Why does mrs norman talk about her kid walking through the school door. THEY DONT! GOOD LORD! YOU ARE THE BIGGEST HORSES ASS I KNOW. SHUT UP. Send your kids to public school first then talk.
At one point, Ms. Norman reportedly homeschool one or all of her children, which leads us to ask the question, "Why?" Why homeschool and then get yourself elected to the school board? Do you, Ms. Norman, have some personal vendetta against the school system?
I voted for the new board because I thought the old board was too closed minded and hindered our childrens education. I now see that I was wrong. Please!!! Read the "Kite Runner" with an open mind and all will see the grandstanding that is going on.
I sure hope there is some more sex or blood in the next book. How about pictures to help the readers understand some of the scenes. You never know some of the pictures could be painted in art class!!
One kid graduated from FHS. The middle kid, I think, graduates this year now that all of his many charges, including two counts of carrying a concealed GUN have been dismissed, and the youngest kid - I do not know where or if he is in public school.
If you do not trust the school system to educate your children, why would you want to be on that system's board? Years ago, Cindy Coleman, who also home-schooled, was soundly defeated in her bid for school board for that very reason. But Ms. Coleman did not have a political machine behind her.
I can't believe no one has picked up on this yet, but I can't help myself. Ms. Dobson stated "to me, this teacher raped their minds with no parental consent." As if someone is going to GIVE parental consent to mind-raping (by the way, I don't consider mind-raping and reading a piece of award-winning literature synonymous). To echo one of Ms. Norman's comments about why the book should be considered inappropriate, think about a child that has been raped. Do you think they will appreciate Ms. Dobson's comments? In response to the blogger who indicated a need for pictures to help aid the understanding of the book, some of us actually have good reading comprehension skills, thereby eliminating the need for photos. We also understand the underlying themes and issues that are presented in the book (which do not focus merely on sodomy, instead using it as an example of the manifestation of good vs. evil and the various conflicts within and among the characters that it creates. By the way, I've actually read the book, which makes it much easier to comment about the situation.
Cool. So what grade is sodomy taught in BCPS? Were they taught that before the book or during? So unless you are blind I would think pictues would tell alot about the story. As long as you hear no evil or see no evil then reading makes it all better. Great concept. I bet you just hate movies if a book is available. You are funny. Now that's a big stab for the artistic minded. Now I bet it takes a long time to write a family picture!!! .....grammar check please...
To the March 8 4 PM post, I don't recall anyone mentioning that BCPS was teaching sodomy. I also don't BCPS is teaching adultery, but students will read about it if they read another classic work of literature entitled "The Scarlett Letter." Perhaps you've heard of it. I don't think BCPS is teaching masturbation, but students will read about (subtly) if they read The Chocolate War. I don't think BCPS is teaching teens about sex and teen pregnancy, but there are several fine books, including The Outsiders and The First Part Last, in which teens become pregnant. If you do in fact rely on "picture books" for your literary needs, I understand that you won't be familiar with these works. Let me try another example with which you may be more familiar. The Cat in the Hat, by Dr. Seuss, features two small children who allow a "stranger" (the cat) to come into their home. The message is NOT about allowing strangers into your home, but it does take place.
If your implication is that someone should somehow be ashamed that they prefer to read literature instead of watching movies, I would also be guilty as charged. I can see how that will make ME look bad...
The cat is out of the bag. You blogging geniuses have have finally stumbled across the truth.
Tracy Norman hates children, and she hates the idea of educating them. She wishes they were all dead. Dead and stupid.
Why? Because she wants to take over the world. If the generation coming up is uneducated, it paves the way for the successful implementation of her grand plan. She absolutely abhors the public education system.
That's why she didn't fold under the pressure of not one, but TWO attempts to have her removed from this board. That's why she puts up with Buddy's unending insults.
She must prevail to maintain her great power on the most influential board in this county. Her next step is the State Board of Education. Then, she'll move to the Department of Education in Washington, DC, where she will -- mark my words -- dismantle the entire public educational system of the United States.
I wonder if Heather, Cheryl and Eric will realize Tracy's real motive and public an article about this. I just hope Heather doesn't try to use the f*** word in the newspaper in order to make her point.
Well, you're at least partly correct (about the power trip, that is). Why else would she insist on "her own way", rather than follow established BOE protocol?
On the other hand, it appears Ms. Norman simply insists that children be educated in a vacuum, with no introduction to the outside world. The problem is, sooner or later, we all have to face that real world. Like it or not, that world has an "ugly side" and to instill the complete naivete she insists upon in our students does them a huge injustice in the long term.
Had she truly taken the time to READ THE BOOK, and not just a couple of passages, she might have come to the same conclusion that many in the community have already made.
The real tragedy here is the fact that this entire "book banning" episode started based upon hearsay and second-hand opinion. Neither Ms. Norman, nor Ms. Dobson read this book cover-to-cover before launching this witch hunt. Had they done their due diligence in the matter before stirring this political hornet's nest, we probably wouldn't be having this "conversation".
When all is said and done, all this does is continue to damage the credibility of this board. This type of grandstanding has already generated some very undesirable attention, both in media and legal circles. To continue on this path will only isolate this group from the very people it supposed to be serving. In addition, it will do considerable damage to the ability of this community to attract business and growth opportunities.
I just hope the rest of the board comes to its senses on this issue before too much damage is done.
Tracy Norman is not on the board for the children of Burke County - she is on the board to be SEEN and HEARD! As a parent, I sure do not want Tracy Norman doing what she "thinks is best" for my children - she has done a pitiful job raising her own children - so who in their right mind would want her to make decisions for their children - she has one child that has had numerous charges including drug and concealed weapons and her youngest child lives with his father - so hopefully he will have a chance. Tracy Norman made the decision to toss her own family aside and run with Tim Buff - so in my opinion she is a pretty worthless parent - again, I do not want her making decisions for my children. She needs to be at home taking care of her own family rather than running to every event in Burke County with Tim Buff - what a shame that a mother would choose to fulfill her own needs to be in the public spot light rather than be a mother to her children. But the amazing thing is that Charlotte Buff just stands to the side and watches the whole thing...UNBELIEVABLE!!!
“It is said that power corrupts, but actually it's more true that power attracts the corruptible. The sane are usually attracted by other things than power.” David Brin
Although 8:13 AM is commenting with tongue-in-cheek, even those of us who would like Tracy to abdicate her throne do not believe she hates children. She just doesn't understand them, doesn't believe any child has a smidgen of discernability, and feels the need to use children to enhance her public image. For example, at a school function last year, Tracy grabbed up a little kid and placed it on her lap. Not sure if she knew the little one or her parents, but she sure did get the the attention of school employees who commented out loud how "calculated" her actions were. She has an insatiable need for acceptance and attention, and she doesn't care if the attention is positive or negative. That's why she nor her boss have a clue that their constant presence together implies impropriety. They just don't get it.
They don't seem to care that Tim-and-Tracy sitings are the topic of so many conversations. J & S Cafeteria, Tri-County Grill, Tastee Freeze, Hannah's BBQ, Turkey calling at a Community House event, rabbit hunting together with Tony Robinson in McDowell and Rutherford counties - the list is endless.
No, she doesn't hate children. She just doesn't have any business trying to be their advocate.
I'm guessing Glen won't post this for us, so this is copied from the morganton.com website. My favorite part is about Matthews. Enjoy!
MEASURE FROM EXCELLENCE
For the record, book banning and censorship occur when books are prevented from being published. That happens in communist countries and dictatorships.
In our country it is impossible with Internet publishing and shopping.
When teachers choose one curriculum over another have they banned the rejected curriculum?
Of course not, they have made a choice.
The same is true with choosing to use or not to use a novel in class. If parents really think their child will remain uneducated or his brains desiccate from not reading "The Kite Runner," there is the library and the bookstore. So can we cut the hysteria over academic freedom?
"The Kite Runner" is a well-written book, but Khaled Hosseini makes the cheap shot of injecting a graphic description of sodomy and in subsequent pages increases the details through the victim's recollections.
He could have achieved a more powerful book had he been defter. However, he's a smart guy; he knows that prurience sells.
Unfortunately, we tend to excuse explicit material if the author writes well, as if his talent makes it OK.
Fiction takes us into the realm of imagination where we supply most of the details.
We can be enthralled and moved by a story while still being detached observers.
Explicit sexual descriptions are never necessary; they are always gratuitous. Their purpose is to eliminate any detachment a reader has from the action, so he is forced to vicariously experience it and become a voyeur.
The reader, through his imagination, participates in the boy's violation.
The little boy gets raped and so does the reader. That is the effective goal of pornography, whether in words or images, to shock, shame and violate the reader or viewer. Such descriptions are desensitizing.
When people say "So what?" and don't flinch when reading such a passage, it is not a sign of maturity or sophistication, but it is a sign of corruption.
As people ingest a steady diet of vulgar, sexually explicit movies, TV shows, books and plays, their power to discern the truly good from the trash is dulled and eventually destroyed.
Explicit sex in popular culture has a long-term corrosive effect on one's judgment.
The fact that so many parents want their youth to read a book with graphic sodomy as its pivotal scene proves our salacious culture has jaded their sensibilities.
I've heard youth and adults say in effect: What's the big deal? Teenagers see and hear enough obscenity walking through the halls of Freedom High School. "The Kite Runner" is nothing by comparison.
Since when did we start measuring quality from the bottom of the cesspool instead of from the heights of excellence?
Shouldn't education not only be instructive but also ennobling? True, young people should not be sheltered from the tough stuff of life, but that information doesn't have to be pornographically expressed in order for them to be informed. An informed mind doesn't have to be a depraved mind.
Boris Pasternak's book "Dr. Zhivago" deals with brutality, adultery and even incest without one single sexually explicit scene.
Along with that novel students could read Bruce Lockhart's eye witness account of Russia before and during the revolution from his memoir "British Agent."
Some of his descriptions are eerily similar to Pasternak's. A great side-along text would Richard Pipes "The Russian Revolution."
Miron Dolot's memoir "Execution By Hunger" recounts Stalin's planned starvation of Ukraine through his "farm collectivization."
He recounts Ukraine's unique culture prior to the famine when they were the largest exporter of wheat in the world, up through the defoliation of the forests by starving people and the outbreaks of cannibalism. Though plain spoken, there are no pornographic descriptions. A good side-along text is Robert Conquest's "Harvest of Sorrow" which recounts the famine as well as the international media's collusion to suppress what Stalin was doing.
Fast forward to modern Sudan where for decades they have suffered genocide. Moslems have murdered Christian men, raped their wives and sold them into slavery and put their children into Moslem reeducation camps.
The media has largely ignored the genocide until about five years ago. Here we have two cultures, 70 years apart, with two human-caused pandemics both largely ignored by the media.
Plenty of scope here for comparison/contrast by the students and detective work through Internet searches.
How about Iraq? Read the biography "Desert Queen: The Extraordinary Life of Gertrude Bell" by Janet Wallach to see how the British tried to help install a monarchy in the 1920s that all the diverse tribes would accept.
Then read Wilfred Thesiger's book "The Marsh Arabs" about his time spent during the 1950s with this group of southeastern Iraq, which had remained unchanged for millennia.
Fast forward to 2003, when 38 nations joined forces to oust Saddam Hussein. The Iraq museum in Baghdad that was looted was the same one Gertrude Bell established.
Saddam had tried to destroy the Marsh Arabs by draining the marshes. Since his overthrow, engineers have helped to restore the marshes and saved that unique culture from extinction.
Today a coalition of nations is trying to help Iraq establish a republic that will be acceptable to all the diverse tribes.
Does history repeat itself? It's worth exploring.
Some of the most fatuous comments in this debate have been made by the Rev. Tony Matthews when he excuses "The Kite Runner" because the Bible and Shakespeare deal with murders and rapes, etc.
Perhaps Matthews has been neglecting his Bible reading but there is not one sexually explicit pornographic scene in the whole Bible.
Rabbis and ministers alike have marveled that the Bible is able to deal with all sins without causing the reader to sin.
There is a huge difference between informing people of a sin and forcing them to see it and act it out in their own minds.
Likewise, Shakespeare, though plainspoken, bawdy and earthy, is not pornographic.
Mr. Matthews's eager desire for his 15-year-old daughter to deal with sodomy raises questions.
Where have all the manly men gone who use to protect their daughters from vice and indecency, instead of colluding in their corruption and calling it education?
In fact, where are the manly men who used to fill our pulpits?
Now many pulpits are supplied by eunuchs who are impotent to either stand for Biblical truth or stand against wickedness.
Happily they adjust to our ever coarsening culture while keeping their flocks cocooned in soft, simpering messages of peace and unity.
The Bible teaches us to be thorough-going realists.
It also teaches us to guard our minds since sin begins in our thoughts.
We can't have moral discernment without a virtuous mind and you can't maintain a virtuous mind by gazing in a cesspool.
There are many, better, more worthwhile books for students to read. To understand Afghanistan, Ben Macintyre's book "The Man Who Would Be King: The First American in Afghanistan" is a pretty good place to start.
Actually, I enjoy reading any well-written argument, and Ms. Fein has stated her side well. After all, this is America and she is entitled to her opinion. However, I patently disagree with her definition of censorship (the real key to this entire mess).
Well here's what the ALA (American Library Association) has to say about the subject of censorship. While it speaks from more of a librarian's point of view, it relates very well to the current situation in Burke County.
“If all mankind minus one were of one opinion, and only one person were of the contrary opinion, mankind would be no more justified in silencing that one person, than he, if he had the power, would be justified in silencing mankind.”— John Stuart Mill, On Liberty
“He that would make his own liberty secure, must guard even his enemy from opposition: for if he violates this duty he establishes a precedent that will reach to himself. ”— Thomas Paine, Dissertation On First Principles Of Government
What Is Intellectual Freedom?
Intellectual freedom is the right of every individual to both seek and receive information from all points of view without restriction. It provides for free access to all expressions of ideas through which any and all sides of a question, cause or movement may be explored.
Why Is Intellectual Freedom Important?
Intellectual freedom is the basis for our democratic system. We expect our people to be self-governors. But to do so responsibly, our citizenry must be well-informed. Libraries provide the ideas and information, in a variety of formats, to allow people to inform themselves.
Intellectual freedom encompasses the freedom to hold, receive and disseminate ideas.
What Is Censorship?
Censorship is the suppression of ideas and information that certain persons—individuals, groups or government officials—find objectionable or dangerous. It is no more complicated than someone saying, “Don’t let anyone read this book, or buy that magazine, or view that film, because I object to it! ” Censors try to use the power of the state to impose their view of what is truthful and appropriate, or offensive and objectionable, on everyone else. Censors pressure public institutions, like libraries, to suppress and remove from public access information they judge inappropriate or dangerous, so that no one else has the chance to read or view the material and make up their own minds about it. The censor wants to prejudge materials for everyone.
How Does Censorship Happen?
Censorship occurs when expressive materials, like books, magazines, films and videos, or works of art, are removed or kept from public access. Individuals and pressure groups identify materials to which they object. Sometimes they succeed in pressuring schools not to use them, libraries not to shelve them, book and video stores not to carry them, publishers not to publish them, or art galleries not to display them. Censorship also occurs when materials are restricted to particular audiences, based on their age or other characteristics.
Who Attempts Censorship?
In most instances, a censor is a sincerely concerned individual who believes that censorship can improve society, protect children, and restore what the censor sees as lost moral values. But under the First Amendment to the United States Constitution, each of us has the right to read, view, listen to, and disseminate constitutionally protected ideas, even if a censor finds those ideas offensive.
What Is The Relationship Between Censorship And Intellectual Freedom?
In expressing their opinions and concerns, would-be censors are exercising the same rights librarians seek to protect when they confront censorship. In making their criticisms known, people who object to certain ideas are exercising the same rights as those who created and disseminated the material to which they object. Their rights to voice opinions and try to persuade others to adopt those opinions is protected only if the rights of persons to express ideas they despise are also protected. The rights of both sides must be protected, or neither will survive.
How Do Censors Justify Their Demands That Information Be Suppressed?
Censors might sincerely believe that certain materials are so offensive, or present ideas that are so hateful and destructive to society, that they simply must not see the light of day. Others are worried that younger or weaker people will be badly influenced by bad ideas, and will do bad things as a result. Still others believe that there is a very clear distinction between ideas that are right and morally uplifting, and ideas that are wrong and morally corrupting, and wish to ensure that society has the benefit of their perception. They believe that certain individuals, certain institutions, even society itself, will be endangered if particular ideas are disseminated without restriction. What censors often don’t consider is that, if they succeed in suppressing the ideas they don’t like today, others may use that precedent to suppress the ideas they do like tomorrow.
What Are The Most Frequently Censored Materials?
Throughout history, books have been challenged for many reasons, including political content, sexual expression, or language offensive to some people’s racial, cultural, or ethnic background, gender or sexuality, or political or religious beliefs. Materials considered heretical, blasphemous, seditious, obscene or inappropriate for children have often been censored.
Since the dawn of recorded human expression, people have been burned at the stake, forced to drink poison, crucified, ostracized and vilified for what they wrote and believed.
Aren’t There Some Kinds Of Expression That Really Should Be Censored?
The United States Supreme Court has ruled that there are certain narrow categories of speech that are not protected by the First Amendment: obscenity, child pornography, defamation, and “fighting words,” or speech that incites immediate and imminent lawless action. The government is also allowed to enforce secrecy of some information when it is considered essential to national security, like troop movements in time of war, classified information about defense, etc.
What Is Obscenity?
Sexual expression is a frequent target of censorship. But the Supreme Court has told us that material is not obscene unless a judge or jury finds that an average person, applying contemporary community standards, would find that the material appeals to the prurient (or morbid, shameful, and unhealthy) interest in sex (note that, by its definition, the Court implicitly recognized that there is such a thing as a healthy interest in sex!); that it depicts or describes certain sexual acts defined in state law in a patently offensive way; and that a reasonable person (community standards do not control this last element) would find that the material lacks serious literary, artistic, political or scientific value. All three elements must be present for material to be judged by a judge or jury as obscene and, therefore, illegal.
What About Protecting Children From Pornography, Whether Or Not It Is Legally Obscene?
The primary responsibility for rearing children rests with parents. If parents want to keep certain ideas or forms of expression away from their children, they must assume the responsibility for shielding those children. Governmental institutions cannot be expected to usurp or interfere with parental obligations and responsibilities when it comes to deciding what a child may read or view.
How Do You Guide Children When You Can’t Be With Them 24 Hours A Day?
Parents who believe that the current state of society and communications make it difficult to shield their children must nevertheless find a way to cope with what they see as that reality within the context of their own family. Libraries can be extremely helpful, providing information about parenting, open communication between parents and children, how to communicate with caregivers and the parents of your children’s friends about your rules, and the opinions of various organizations representing a wide spectrum of points of view about materials for children.
If a child borrows something from a library which that child’s parent believes is inappropriate, the parents are encouraged to return the item and make use of the expertise of their librarian to locate materials they prefer, among the hundreds of thousands of choices most public libraries make available.
Don’t Librarians Censor Everything They Choose Not To Buy For The Library?
No library can make everything available, and selection decisions must be made. Selection is an inclusive process, where the library affirmatively seeks out materials which will serve its mission of providing a broad diversity of points of view and subject matter. By contrast, censorship is an exclusive process, by which individuals or institutions seek to deny access to or otherwise suppress ideas and information because they find those ideas offensive and do not want others to have access to them. There are many objective reasons unrelated to the ideas expressed in materials that a library might decide not to add those materials to its collection: redundancy, lack of community interest, expense, space, etc. Unless the decision is based on a disapproval of the ideas expressed and desire to keep those ideas away from public access, a decision not to select materials for a library collection is not censorship.
What If I Can’t Find Something In My Library That Represents My Point Of View?
Ask for the materials you want. Libraries strive to serve the interests of the entire community. If your library is unable to purchase the material you want, it may be able to obtain it for you on interlibrary loan. Your library is there to help you find the information you need or want.
If Materials Are On A Library Shelf, Doesn’t That Mean The Library Approves Of Those Materials?
The presence of any particular materials in a library collection does not imply endorsement of the ideas expressed in those materials. The library is simply doing its job as a neutral provider of information from all points of view—if the library “endorses” anything, it is your right to have access to a broad selection of materials. If you don’t find materials to your liking, ask your librarian to help you!
What Can I Do To Fight Censorship?
Stay informed. Know what is happening in your state legislature, local school and library boards, and city councils. Write letters expressing your view to your mayor, and your state and federal representatives and senators. Attend your local school and library board meetings.
In response to the E. Fein comments, it seems as if you are very passionate about this issue. Please understand others feel just as strongly, they just don't agree with you. The great thing about this blog is that you DID have the opportunity to post the information. Imagine if "Glen" had unilaterally NOT allowed it. How would you respond to someone who objected to their student reading one of the books that you suggested? You would try to defend it, and hopefully the policy that actually exists would be followed by our local board members.
The ALA comment indicated that the key issue is censorship. While I whole-heartedly agree that is an important issue, I think it is even simpler than that: members of the local school board making decisions based on personal preferences and not following policy that is available for anyone to see/read. While some people may agree with the decision to ignore policy and pull the book prior to the process being followed, just imagine how you will feel when (not if, when) the board members DON'T agree with you. It is unsettling when three of the major decisions that the current board has made have been based on "feelings" and concerns instead of objective criteria or policies. I certainly did not agree with all of the decisions made by the previous board either, but I think there are some valid concerns about the current board as well.
Now that is a real good point. To think that home schooled kids don't get a taste of reality unless they are in "Public School". So why don't we just insist on a church on one side of the school and an ABC store on the other side. Then put a strip club across the street along with a recruitment office beside it. The heck with needing to be 18 to join the service instead let them go whenever they get the notion. Why should they get a sheltered life? You people in here are an absolute joke. ..... But you are entertaining.......
In response to Ms. Fein's letter, I do not feel that her opinion of Rev. Matthews was AT ALL appropriate. How dare she speak in such a manner about a man who wanted to give his opinion (AS A PARENT)about a book. Just because someone disagrees with how she feels does not give her the right to question his style of parenting, preaching, or manhood for that matter. She went too far. Sadly, it does not suprise me that the News Herald actually allowed it.
The word on the street is that Ms. Dobson has appealed the FHS decision regarding The Kite Runner to the next level.
Now, a SYSTEM-WIDE advisory committee will review the book to determine its literary value and decide if the book should be made available to high school students.
1) There's nothing in the NC Standard Course of Study that requires a read that is profane, indecent, vulgar or demeaning.
2) There's already NCDPI policy for educator ethics: a) Specifically 16NCAC6C.602(5) b) Conduct with students. The educator shall treat all students with respect. The educator shall not commit any abusive act or sexual exploitation with, to, or in the presence of a student, whether or not that student is or has been under the care or supervision of that educator, as defined below: (A) any use of language that is considered profane, vulgar, or demeaning;
1) Books all contain language... 2) If an educator assigns a reading that meets the element of 5(A)it's the same as if they had spoken it to the child;
Teachers need to heed Article 15 of the NC State Constitution and the constitutional guarantee to every "child of the state" to a "sound basic education". If educators push the limit on readings, and "sound" is defined as "not profane, indecent, vulgar or demeaning" the teacher will find themselves in a situation where they have violated a child's "state civil rights" and there are no defined limits for damages.
If educators choose to disregard the language of established policy, and the constitutional law regarding the rights of children and their education you're in for a rude awakening.
NCDPI violated the constitutional rights in the Leandro case. Google it. Now they've got Judge Howard Manning watching every move they make.
Read the policy at: http://sbepolicy.dpi.state.nc.us/policies/QP-C-014.asp?pri=02&cat=C&pol=014&acr=QP
You can Google the NC State Constitution yourself.
Quit arguing and start following the law! If you don't understand it today, that's Ok, tomorrow's another opportunity...
29 comments:
So now this teacher is a rapist - of minds, no less. I don't know Tracy, isn't rape a lynchable offense?
Just one more reason for people outside Burke County to be glad their kids don't go to our schools.
Well, you know us teaching types. We're just a bunch of mind rapin' fools.
Tracy, get yer mule. There's gonna be a hangin' uptown tonite.
Now that's what I call entertainment!! Yeeehawwww!!!
Why does mrs norman talk about her kid walking through the school door. THEY DONT! GOOD LORD! YOU ARE THE BIGGEST HORSES ASS I KNOW. SHUT UP. Send your kids to public school first then talk.
3/3/08 8:30PM,
Two of her three children do attend BCPS schools. What are YOU talking about???
At one point, Ms. Norman reportedly homeschool one or all of her children, which leads us to ask the question, "Why?" Why homeschool and then get yourself elected to the school board? Do you, Ms. Norman, have some personal vendetta against the school system?
What are YOU talking about .... 2 of Tracy's 3 children DO NOT attend BCPS - get your facts straight!!!
What is the reason 2 of her 3 children do not attend BCPS? Did they at one time?
I voted for the new board because I thought the old board was too closed minded and hindered our childrens education. I now see that I was wrong. Please!!! Read the "Kite Runner" with an open mind and all will see the grandstanding that is going on.
I sure hope there is some more sex or blood in the next book. How about pictures to help the readers understand some of the scenes. You never know some of the pictures could be painted in art class!!
One kid graduated from FHS. The middle kid, I think, graduates this year now that all of his many charges, including two counts of carrying a concealed GUN have been dismissed, and the youngest kid - I do not know where or if he is in public school.
If you do not trust the school system to educate your children, why would you want to be on that system's board? Years ago, Cindy Coleman, who also home-schooled, was soundly defeated in her bid for school board for that very reason. But Ms. Coleman did not have a political machine behind her.
I can't believe no one has picked up on this yet, but I can't help myself. Ms. Dobson stated "to me, this teacher raped their minds with no parental consent." As if someone is going to GIVE parental consent to mind-raping (by the way, I don't consider mind-raping and reading a piece of award-winning literature synonymous). To echo one of Ms. Norman's comments about why the book should be considered inappropriate, think about a child that has been raped. Do you think they will appreciate Ms. Dobson's comments?
In response to the blogger who indicated a need for pictures to help aid the understanding of the book, some of us actually have good reading comprehension skills, thereby eliminating the need for photos. We also understand the underlying themes and issues that are presented in the book (which do not focus merely on sodomy, instead using it as an example of the manifestation of good vs. evil and the various conflicts within and among the characters that it creates. By the way, I've actually read the book, which makes it much easier to comment about the situation.
Cool. So what grade is sodomy taught in BCPS? Were they taught that before the book or during? So unless you are blind I would think pictues would tell alot about the story. As long as you hear no evil or see no evil then reading makes it all better. Great concept. I bet you just hate movies if a book is available. You are funny. Now that's a big stab for the artistic minded. Now I bet it takes a long time to write a family picture!!! .....grammar check please...
So what's your point?
To the March 8 4 PM post, I don't recall anyone mentioning that BCPS was teaching sodomy. I also don't BCPS is teaching adultery, but students will read about it if they read another classic work of literature entitled "The Scarlett Letter." Perhaps you've heard of it. I don't think BCPS is teaching masturbation, but students will read about (subtly) if they read The Chocolate War. I don't think BCPS is teaching teens about sex and teen pregnancy, but there are several fine books, including The Outsiders and The First Part Last, in which teens become pregnant. If you do in fact rely on "picture books" for your literary needs, I understand that you won't be familiar with these works. Let me try another example with which you may be more familiar. The Cat in the Hat, by Dr. Seuss, features two small children who allow a "stranger" (the cat) to come into their home. The message is NOT about allowing strangers into your home, but it does take place.
If your implication is that someone should somehow be ashamed that they prefer to read literature instead of watching movies, I would also be guilty as charged. I can see how that will make ME look bad...
The cat is out of the bag. You blogging geniuses have have finally stumbled across the truth.
Tracy Norman hates children, and she hates the idea of educating them. She wishes they were all dead. Dead and stupid.
Why? Because she wants to take over the world. If the generation coming up is uneducated, it paves the way for the successful implementation of her grand plan. She absolutely abhors the public education system.
That's why she didn't fold under the pressure of not one, but TWO attempts to have her removed from this board. That's why she puts up with Buddy's unending insults.
She must prevail to maintain her great power on the most influential board in this county. Her next step is the State Board of Education. Then, she'll move to the Department of Education in Washington, DC, where she will -- mark my words -- dismantle the entire public educational system of the United States.
I wonder if Heather, Cheryl and Eric will realize Tracy's real motive and public an article about this. I just hope Heather doesn't try to use the f*** word in the newspaper in order to make her point.
Well, you're at least partly correct (about the power trip, that is). Why else would she insist on "her own way", rather than follow established BOE protocol?
On the other hand, it appears Ms. Norman simply insists that children be educated in a vacuum, with no introduction to the outside world. The problem is, sooner or later, we all have to face that real world. Like it or not, that world has an "ugly side" and to instill the complete naivete she insists upon in our students does them a huge injustice in the long term.
Had she truly taken the time to READ THE BOOK, and not just a couple of passages, she might have come to the same conclusion that many in the community have already made.
The real tragedy here is the fact that this entire "book banning" episode started based upon hearsay and second-hand opinion. Neither Ms. Norman, nor Ms. Dobson read this book cover-to-cover before launching this witch hunt. Had they done their due diligence in the matter before stirring this political hornet's nest, we probably wouldn't be having this "conversation".
When all is said and done, all this does is continue to damage the credibility of this board. This type of grandstanding has already generated some very undesirable attention, both in media and legal circles. To continue on this path will only isolate this group from the very people it supposed to be serving. In addition, it will do considerable damage to the ability of this community to attract business and growth opportunities.
I just hope the rest of the board comes to its senses on this issue before too much damage is done.
Tracy Norman is not on the board for the children of Burke County - she is on the board to be SEEN and HEARD! As a parent, I sure do not want Tracy Norman doing what she "thinks is best" for my children - she has done a pitiful job raising her own children - so who in their right mind would want her to make decisions for their children - she has one child that has had numerous charges including drug and concealed weapons and her youngest child lives with his father - so hopefully he will have a chance. Tracy Norman made the decision to toss her own family aside and run with Tim Buff - so in my opinion she is a pretty worthless parent - again, I do not want her making decisions for my children. She needs to be at home taking care of her own family rather than running to every event in Burke County with Tim Buff - what a shame that a mother would choose to fulfill her own needs to be in the public spot light rather than be a mother to her children. But the amazing thing is that Charlotte Buff just stands to the side and watches the whole thing...UNBELIEVABLE!!!
“It is said that power corrupts, but actually it's more true that power attracts the corruptible. The sane are usually attracted by other things than power.” David Brin
Although 8:13 AM is commenting with tongue-in-cheek, even those of us who would like Tracy to abdicate her throne do not believe she hates children. She just doesn't understand them, doesn't believe any child has a smidgen of discernability, and feels the need to use children to enhance her public image. For example, at a school function last year, Tracy grabbed up a little kid and placed it on her lap. Not sure if she knew the little one or her parents, but she sure did get the the attention of school employees who commented out loud how "calculated" her actions were. She has an insatiable need for acceptance and attention, and she doesn't care if the attention is positive or negative. That's why she nor her boss have a clue that their constant presence together implies impropriety. They just don't get it.
They don't seem to care that Tim-and-Tracy sitings are the topic of so many conversations. J & S Cafeteria, Tri-County Grill, Tastee Freeze, Hannah's BBQ, Turkey calling at a Community House event, rabbit hunting together with Tony Robinson in McDowell and Rutherford counties - the list is endless.
No, she doesn't hate children. She just doesn't have any business trying to be their advocate.
I'm guessing Glen won't post this for us, so this is copied from the morganton.com website. My favorite part is about Matthews. Enjoy!
MEASURE FROM EXCELLENCE
For the record, book banning and censorship occur when books are prevented from being published.
That happens in communist countries and dictatorships.
In our country it is impossible with Internet publishing and shopping.
When teachers choose one curriculum over another have they banned the rejected curriculum?
Of course not, they have made a choice.
The same is true with choosing to use or not to use a novel in class. If parents really think their child will remain uneducated or his brains desiccate from not reading "The Kite Runner," there is the library and the bookstore. So can we cut the hysteria over academic freedom?
"The Kite Runner" is a well-written book, but Khaled Hosseini makes the cheap shot of injecting a graphic description of sodomy and in subsequent pages increases the details through the victim's recollections.
He could have achieved a more powerful book had he been defter. However, he's a smart guy; he knows that prurience sells.
Unfortunately, we tend to excuse explicit material if the author writes well, as if his talent makes it OK.
Fiction takes us into the realm of imagination where we supply most of the details.
We can be enthralled and moved by a story while still being detached observers.
Explicit sexual descriptions are never necessary; they are always gratuitous. Their purpose is to eliminate any detachment a reader has from the action, so he is forced to vicariously experience it and become a voyeur.
The reader, through his imagination, participates in the boy's violation.
The little boy gets raped and so does the reader. That is the effective goal of pornography, whether in words or images, to shock, shame and violate the reader or viewer. Such descriptions are desensitizing.
When people say "So what?" and don't flinch when reading such a passage, it is not a sign of maturity or sophistication, but it is a sign of corruption.
As people ingest a steady diet of vulgar, sexually explicit movies, TV shows, books and plays, their power to discern the truly good from the trash is dulled and eventually destroyed.
Explicit sex in popular culture has a long-term corrosive effect on one's judgment.
The fact that so many parents want their youth to read a book with graphic sodomy as its pivotal scene proves our salacious culture has jaded their sensibilities.
I've heard youth and adults say in effect: What's the big deal? Teenagers see and hear enough obscenity walking through the halls of Freedom High School. "The Kite Runner" is nothing by comparison.
Since when did we start measuring quality from the bottom of the cesspool instead of from the heights of excellence?
Shouldn't education not only be instructive but also ennobling? True, young people should not be sheltered from the tough stuff of life, but that information doesn't have to be pornographically expressed in order for them to be informed. An informed mind doesn't have to be a depraved mind.
Boris Pasternak's book "Dr. Zhivago" deals with brutality, adultery and even incest without one single sexually explicit scene.
Along with that novel students could read Bruce Lockhart's eye witness account of Russia before and during the revolution from his memoir "British Agent."
Some of his descriptions are eerily similar to Pasternak's. A great side-along text would Richard Pipes "The Russian Revolution."
Miron Dolot's memoir "Execution By Hunger" recounts Stalin's planned starvation of Ukraine through his "farm collectivization."
He recounts Ukraine's unique culture prior to the famine when they were the largest exporter of wheat in the world, up through the defoliation of the forests by starving people and the outbreaks of cannibalism. Though plain spoken, there are no pornographic descriptions. A good side-along text is Robert Conquest's "Harvest of Sorrow" which recounts the famine as well as the international media's collusion to suppress what Stalin was doing.
Fast forward to modern Sudan where for decades they have suffered genocide. Moslems have murdered Christian men, raped their wives and sold them into slavery and put their children into Moslem reeducation camps.
The media has largely ignored the genocide until about five years ago. Here we have two cultures, 70 years apart, with two human-caused pandemics both largely ignored by the media.
Plenty of scope here for comparison/contrast by the students and detective work through Internet searches.
How about Iraq? Read the biography "Desert Queen: The Extraordinary Life of Gertrude Bell" by Janet Wallach to see how the British tried to help install a monarchy in the 1920s that all the diverse tribes would accept.
Then read Wilfred Thesiger's book "The Marsh Arabs" about his time spent during the 1950s with this group of southeastern Iraq, which had remained unchanged for millennia.
Fast forward to 2003, when 38 nations joined forces to oust Saddam Hussein. The Iraq museum in Baghdad that was looted was the same one Gertrude Bell established.
Saddam had tried to destroy the Marsh Arabs by draining the marshes. Since his overthrow, engineers have helped to restore the marshes and saved that unique culture from extinction.
Today a coalition of nations is trying to help Iraq establish a republic that will be acceptable to all the diverse tribes.
Does history repeat itself? It's worth exploring.
Some of the most fatuous comments in this debate have been made by the Rev. Tony Matthews when he excuses "The Kite Runner" because the Bible and Shakespeare deal with murders and rapes, etc.
Perhaps Matthews has been neglecting his Bible reading but there is not one sexually explicit pornographic scene in the whole Bible.
Rabbis and ministers alike have marveled that the Bible is able to deal with all sins without causing the reader to sin.
There is a huge difference between informing people of a sin and forcing them to see it and act it out in their own minds.
Likewise, Shakespeare, though plainspoken, bawdy and earthy, is not pornographic.
Mr. Matthews's eager desire for his 15-year-old daughter to deal with sodomy raises questions.
Where have all the manly men gone who use to protect their daughters from vice and indecency, instead of colluding in their corruption and calling it education?
In fact, where are the manly men who used to fill our pulpits?
Now many pulpits are supplied by eunuchs who are impotent to either stand for Biblical truth or stand against wickedness.
Happily they adjust to our ever coarsening culture while keeping their flocks cocooned in soft, simpering messages of peace and unity.
The Bible teaches us to be thorough-going realists.
It also teaches us to guard our minds since sin begins in our thoughts.
We can't have moral discernment without a virtuous mind and you can't maintain a virtuous mind by gazing in a cesspool.
There are many, better, more worthwhile books for students to read. To understand Afghanistan, Ben Macintyre's book "The Man Who Would Be King: The First American in Afghanistan" is a pretty good place to start.
Eugenie B. Fein
Morganton
Actually, I enjoy reading any well-written argument, and Ms. Fein has stated her side well. After all, this is America and she is entitled to her opinion. However, I patently disagree with her definition of censorship (the real key to this entire mess).
Well here's what the ALA (American Library Association) has to say about the subject of censorship. While it speaks from more of a librarian's point of view, it relates very well to the current situation in Burke County.
Link:
http://www.ala.org/ala/oif/basics/intellectual.htm
“If all mankind minus one were of one opinion, and only one person were of the contrary opinion, mankind would be no more justified in silencing that one person, than he, if he had the power, would be justified in silencing mankind.”— John Stuart Mill, On Liberty
“He that would make his own liberty secure, must guard even his enemy from opposition: for if he violates this duty he establishes a precedent that will reach to himself. ”— Thomas Paine, Dissertation On First Principles Of Government
What Is Intellectual Freedom?
Intellectual freedom is the right of every individual to both seek and receive information from all points of view without restriction. It provides for free access to all expressions of ideas through which any and all sides of a question, cause or movement may be explored.
Why Is Intellectual Freedom Important?
Intellectual freedom is the basis for our democratic system. We expect our people to be self-governors. But to do so responsibly, our citizenry must be well-informed. Libraries provide the ideas and information, in a variety of formats, to allow people to inform themselves.
Intellectual freedom encompasses the freedom to hold, receive and disseminate ideas.
What Is Censorship?
Censorship is the suppression of ideas and information that certain persons—individuals, groups or government officials—find objectionable or dangerous. It is no more complicated than someone saying, “Don’t let anyone read this book, or buy that magazine, or view that film, because I object to it! ” Censors try to use the power of the state to impose their view of what is truthful and appropriate, or offensive and objectionable, on everyone else. Censors pressure public institutions, like libraries, to suppress and remove from public access information they judge inappropriate or dangerous, so that no one else has the chance to read or view the material and make up their own minds about it. The censor wants to prejudge materials for everyone.
How Does Censorship Happen?
Censorship occurs when expressive materials, like books, magazines, films and videos, or works of art, are removed or kept from public access. Individuals and pressure groups identify materials to which they object. Sometimes they succeed in pressuring schools not to use them, libraries not to shelve them, book and video stores not to carry them, publishers not to publish them, or art galleries not to display them. Censorship also occurs when materials are restricted to particular audiences, based on their age or other characteristics.
Who Attempts Censorship?
In most instances, a censor is a sincerely concerned individual who believes that censorship can improve society, protect children, and restore what the censor sees as lost moral values. But under the First Amendment to the United States Constitution, each of us has the right to read, view, listen to, and disseminate constitutionally protected ideas, even if a censor finds those ideas offensive.
What Is The Relationship Between Censorship And Intellectual Freedom?
In expressing their opinions and concerns, would-be censors are exercising the same rights librarians seek to protect when they confront censorship. In making their criticisms known, people who object to certain ideas are exercising the same rights as those who created and disseminated the material to which they object. Their rights to voice opinions and try to persuade others to adopt those opinions is protected only if the rights of persons to express ideas they despise are also protected. The rights of both sides must be protected, or neither will survive.
How Do Censors Justify Their Demands That Information Be Suppressed?
Censors might sincerely believe that certain materials are so offensive, or present ideas that are so hateful and destructive to society, that they simply must not see the light of day. Others are worried that younger or weaker people will be badly influenced by bad ideas, and will do bad things as a result. Still others believe that there is a very clear distinction between ideas that are right and morally uplifting, and ideas that are wrong and morally corrupting, and wish to ensure that society has the benefit of their perception. They believe that certain individuals, certain institutions, even society itself, will be endangered if particular ideas are disseminated without restriction. What censors often don’t consider is that, if they succeed in suppressing the ideas they don’t like today, others may use that precedent to suppress the ideas they do like tomorrow.
What Are The Most Frequently Censored Materials?
Throughout history, books have been challenged for many reasons, including political content, sexual expression, or language offensive to some people’s racial, cultural, or ethnic background, gender or sexuality, or political or religious beliefs. Materials considered heretical, blasphemous, seditious, obscene or inappropriate for children have often been censored.
Since the dawn of recorded human expression, people have been burned at the stake, forced to drink poison, crucified, ostracized and vilified for what they wrote and believed.
Aren’t There Some Kinds Of Expression That Really Should Be Censored?
The United States Supreme Court has ruled that there are certain narrow categories of speech that are not protected by the First Amendment: obscenity, child pornography, defamation, and “fighting words,” or speech that incites immediate and imminent lawless action. The government is also allowed to enforce secrecy of some information when it is considered essential to national security, like troop movements in time of war, classified information about defense, etc.
What Is Obscenity?
Sexual expression is a frequent target of censorship. But the Supreme Court has told us that material is not obscene unless a judge or jury finds that an average person, applying contemporary community standards, would find that the material appeals to the prurient (or morbid, shameful, and unhealthy) interest in sex (note that, by its definition, the Court implicitly recognized that there is such a thing as a healthy interest in sex!); that it depicts or describes certain sexual acts defined in state law in a patently offensive way; and that a reasonable person (community standards do not control this last element) would find that the material lacks serious literary, artistic, political or scientific value. All three elements must be present for material to be judged by a judge or jury as obscene and, therefore, illegal.
What About Protecting Children From Pornography, Whether Or Not It Is Legally Obscene?
The primary responsibility for rearing children rests with parents. If parents want to keep certain ideas or forms of expression away from their children, they must assume the responsibility for shielding those children. Governmental institutions cannot be expected to usurp or interfere with parental obligations and responsibilities when it comes to deciding what a child may read or view.
How Do You Guide Children When You Can’t Be With Them 24 Hours A Day?
Parents who believe that the current state of society and communications make it difficult to shield their children must nevertheless find a way to cope with what they see as that reality within the context of their own family. Libraries can be extremely helpful, providing information about parenting, open communication between parents and children, how to communicate with caregivers and the parents of your children’s friends about your rules, and the opinions of various organizations representing a wide spectrum of points of view about materials for children.
If a child borrows something from a library which that child’s parent believes is inappropriate, the parents are encouraged to return the item and make use of the expertise of their librarian to locate materials they prefer, among the hundreds of thousands of choices most public libraries make available.
Don’t Librarians Censor Everything They Choose Not To Buy For The Library?
No library can make everything available, and selection decisions must be made. Selection is an inclusive process, where the library affirmatively seeks out materials which will serve its mission of providing a broad diversity of points of view and subject matter. By contrast, censorship is an exclusive process, by which individuals or institutions seek to deny access to or otherwise suppress ideas and information because they find those ideas offensive and do not want others to have access to them. There are many objective reasons unrelated to the ideas expressed in materials that a library might decide not to add those materials to its collection: redundancy, lack of community interest, expense, space, etc. Unless the decision is based on a disapproval of the ideas expressed and desire to keep those ideas away from public access, a decision not to select materials for a library collection is not censorship.
What If I Can’t Find Something In My Library That Represents My Point Of View?
Ask for the materials you want. Libraries strive to serve the interests of the entire community. If your library is unable to purchase the material you want, it may be able to obtain it for you on interlibrary loan. Your library is there to help you find the information you need or want.
If Materials Are On A Library Shelf, Doesn’t That Mean The Library Approves Of Those Materials?
The presence of any particular materials in a library collection does not imply endorsement of the ideas expressed in those materials. The library is simply doing its job as a neutral provider of information from all points of view—if the library “endorses” anything, it is your right to have access to a broad selection of materials. If you don’t find materials to your liking, ask your librarian to help you!
What Can I Do To Fight Censorship?
Stay informed. Know what is happening in your state legislature, local school and library boards, and city councils. Write letters expressing your view to your mayor, and your state and federal representatives and senators. Attend your local school and library board meetings.
In response to the E. Fein comments, it seems as if you are very passionate about this issue. Please understand others feel just as strongly, they just don't agree with you. The great thing about this blog is that you DID have the opportunity to post the information. Imagine if "Glen" had unilaterally NOT allowed it. How would you respond to someone who objected to their student reading one of the books that you suggested? You would try to defend it, and hopefully the policy that actually exists would be followed by our local board members.
The ALA comment indicated that the key issue is censorship. While I whole-heartedly agree that is an important issue, I think it is even simpler than that: members of the local school board making decisions based on personal preferences and not following policy that is available for anyone to see/read. While some people may agree with the decision to ignore policy and pull the book prior to the process being followed, just imagine how you will feel when (not if, when) the board members DON'T agree with you. It is unsettling when three of the major decisions that the current board has made have been based on "feelings" and concerns instead of objective criteria or policies. I certainly did not agree with all of the decisions made by the previous board either, but I think there are some valid concerns about the current board as well.
Ms. Fein is another home-schooling parent. Someday, when her kids experience a reality check, I do not think they will be equiped to handle it.
Now that is a real good point. To think that home schooled kids don't get a taste of reality unless they are in "Public School". So why don't we just insist on a church on one side of the school and an ABC store on the other side. Then put a strip club across the street along with a recruitment office beside it. The heck with needing to be 18 to join the service instead let them go whenever they get the notion. Why should they get a sheltered life? You people in here are an absolute joke. ..... But you are entertaining.......
So why would you home school, if not to shelter your children from the "big, bad world"?
"Every burned book enlightens the world." - Ralph Waldo Emerson
Had this book not been brought to my attention, I probably wouldn't have read it anytime soon.
It was a great read, and I even learned a few things. I'm now planning to send a copy to an out-of-state relative. Thanks for enlightening me!
In response to Ms. Fein's letter, I do not feel that her opinion of Rev. Matthews was AT ALL appropriate. How dare she speak in such a manner about a man who wanted to give his opinion (AS A PARENT)about a book. Just because someone disagrees with how she feels does not give her the right to question his style of parenting, preaching, or manhood for that matter. She went too far. Sadly, it does not suprise me that the News Herald actually allowed it.
The word on the street is that Ms. Dobson has appealed the FHS decision regarding The Kite Runner to the next level.
Now, a SYSTEM-WIDE advisory committee will review the book to determine its literary value and decide if the book should be made available to high school students.
Not a time to roll over and give up!
We're off track...
1) There's nothing in the NC Standard Course of Study that requires a read that is profane, indecent, vulgar or demeaning.
2) There's already NCDPI policy for educator ethics:
a) Specifically 16NCAC6C.602(5)
b) Conduct with students. The educator shall treat all students with respect. The educator shall not commit any abusive act or sexual exploitation with, to, or in the presence of a student, whether or not that student is or has been under the care or supervision of that educator, as defined below:
(A) any use of language that is considered profane, vulgar, or demeaning;
1) Books all contain language...
2) If an educator assigns a reading that meets the element of 5(A)it's the same as if they had spoken it to the child;
Teachers need to heed Article 15 of the NC State Constitution and the constitutional guarantee to every "child of the state" to a "sound basic education". If educators push the limit on readings, and "sound" is defined as "not profane, indecent, vulgar or demeaning" the teacher will find themselves in a situation where they have violated a child's "state civil rights" and there are no defined limits for damages.
If educators choose to disregard the language of established policy, and the constitutional law regarding the rights of children and their education you're in for a rude awakening.
NCDPI violated the constitutional rights in the Leandro case. Google it. Now they've got Judge Howard Manning watching every move they make.
Read the policy at: http://sbepolicy.dpi.state.nc.us/policies/QP-C-014.asp?pri=02&cat=C&pol=014&acr=QP
You can Google the NC State Constitution yourself.
Quit arguing and start following the law! If you don't understand it today, that's Ok, tomorrow's another opportunity...
Post a Comment